Elitism in the Backpacking Community

[Chris]

I think we have all seen them. Backpacker "elitists" who verbally destroy newbies or just normal people who aren't wearing the most high tech, advanced gear on the market or anything thats not in Backpacker Style magzine. There is always a lot new people trying to get in on Backpacking and there is always the hardcore seemingly driving many folks away. How many newbies do ya'll think get driven away by such people and what do ya'll think the potential is for it to get worse or maybe better?

[ednotmilkman]

I don't know too many people that might be hardcore and proud of the money they can spend to have the perfect gear to clutter up their house  when not showing it off on their back ??  Forums like this and whiteblaze tend to put the elitists in their proper place when they mouth off also.  Like I said before, even the people on here that get into heated "discussions" are probably all great people once you meet them on a trail.

I do know for sure it's less a problem than road cycling which I have been involved with longer than hiking.

[Chris]

I don't know I've met some people out there that tend to be exactly like the elitists I describe.

[WolfVanZandt]

Heh, folks like me are pretty immune to peer pressure but, regardless, backpacking elitists aren't anywhere close to being in my peer group. I have a few informal backpackers in my peer group - when we hike we throw our gear on and hit the trail - there's not much room for elitism (Well, that's back when I could backpack). The Howlers - well, they're anarchists within their peer group so there's not much chance for elitism there.

Yep, I'm in the enviable position of being able to ignore backpacking elitists, which is really good since I stay broke all the time and, if I had to satisfy others ideas of how I should be equipped in the wild, I'd never make it there.....

[lawnmowwer]

 I have been packing for years. I have packed with some elitists. I was without. I now have great gear, but I will hike with anyone I can. I love the sport/hobby and anything that can help promote it. The fact is that it is about having fun or at least some great memories and friends. I have collected many over the years.

The fact is one of the most "elitists" people I ever hiked with (I will not say a name some of you may know him) is one of the people I would want to see if the $%!& hit the fan. We have had many arguments years back. I hope and think He feels the same.

I don't agree with the mind set but they are still outdoors people and deserve respect just like the minimalist or the the newbie with all old barrowed gear. When they act like it.

[Joshua Szulecki]

I've met a few, and I don't even backpack. There are elitists in every social group, and hiking circles are no different. There are long-distance hiker elitists, there are backpacker elitists, I've even met one waterfall elitist. So far, the only hiking circle I haven't encountered an elitist in is bushwhacking, probably because there are so few bushwhackers who aren't already anti-social. That isn't a dig, I'm also anti-social, I've been known to turn around at trailheads rather than hike with more than one or two cars parked there...

Elitism is an element of the human experience. Some people are better at things than others, and some people THINK they are better at things than others.

The worst gear elitists I've ever encountered have been in amateur radio. We know for a fact that they drive away new people, and have made a concerted effort to chill them out when possible. What's funny is, they are usually well-equipped, but not particularly knowledgable.

[Nalgene Ninja]

There are elitist in every facet of society. HIking is no different. Some are elitist because they carry <10 lbs. Some because their parka, sleeping bag and tent are each $500. Some because they know the genus and phylum of 800 kind of trees. Some because they eat organic tofu, cooked over fair-trade ethanol. Elitism's heart is pride and a need to be recognized for being "better".

[Firedog]

And then there are the rest of us who could give a rip what someone else's opinion, equipment, capability is unless asked for. I enjoy my hobbies/interest for me. I do the best that I can with what I have or know. Always open to learn new things and make my own evaluation. If I encounter someone new, we can enjoy each others interest and share experiences and company or go our own way. Doesn't matter to me. I'm not going to spend my ride worrying about what someone else thinks.  Most of my adult life I've had the mindset that we can agree, or agree to disagree. Or, good meetin ya and see ya later. Carl W.

[Mountain Dog]

I'm not sure I've met any elitist.  I've met people who thought their gear was what everyone should carry and they explained why.  I learned from some and laughed at others.  I guess the most elitist crowd are those with cars.  Now I've met some objectionable people wanting to brag about their vehicles.  Of course, most of the bragging wants you to know just how much they spent.  The "elite" backpackers might just want to impress you with just how little they spent by making something themselves. 

[Skippy]

I'm not sure I've met any elitist.  I've met people who thought their gear was what everyone should carry and they explained why.  I learned from some and laughed at others.  I guess the most elitist crowd are those with cars.  Now I've met some objectionable people wanting to brag about their vehicles.  Of course, most of the bragging wants you to know just how much they spent.  The "elite" backpackers might just want to impress you with just how little they spent by making something themselves. 

I just hope my car makes it there and back!!

[Suz]

The good  thing about hiking and backpacking is that everyone will experience moments where they will be unsure of where they are, where they are going to end up, and how long its going to take to get back to the car/camp/water.  Those moments tend to keep everyone rather humble.

[ednotmilkman]

I'd never have guessed you was anti-social Joshua,

You seem to be virtually social here; whats the difference between here and on a trail?

What's does a waterfall elitist do to prove he is such ?

[Joshua Szulecki]

I'd never have guessed you was anti-social Joshua,

You seem to be virtually social here; whats the difference between here and on a trail?

What's does a waterfall elitist do to prove he is such ?

Oh, I'm definately anti-social, just less so in circles where I'm confortable. That's true in my personal life, but also in hiking. My hiking anti-social issues all stem from two factors: 1) I'm usually taking pictures, and people get in the way, ask questions, ruin shots, etc...; 2) I'm usually hiking with a Chihuahua, and people usually can't resist bugging him and thus via proxy, me.

I'm really bad when it comes to new social circumstances, and I don't even like talking on the telephone with people I've known for years. I'm weird.

A waterfall elitist would brag about what waterfalls they had visited, and mock others for having not visited them, etc... Elitism is mostly about attitude, not apptitude.

[Rob]

There are many valid perspectives here. I have heard people say that your perception is your reality, that doesn't mean it has to be everyone Else's reality, or in fact reality at all. If someone tends to believe that a pack that costs $400 is a SOCIAL element that is a must, I think I'd rather not be a part of the "elite" group. If they choose that same pack because it better serves their personal needs that is completely different. I choose to use the equipment I hike with due to personal preference, not cost, name on the label or because it comes with a fancy little sticker that affords the high end manufacturer with free advertisement when it gets put on your vehicle. I have equipment and clothing that covers a broad spectrum of cost and quality. If I choose to carry a pack and it's contents that weighs 45 pounds, it is my choice and I'm not going to ask someone else to carry it, nor am I going to ask if I'm elite enough to hike the same trails that they are. It doesn't mean I'm enjoying it any less, and it certainly doesn't mean I'm not a "real hiker". The bottom line is, if you are doing what you like to do, why worry about someone Else's opinion of how you are doing it. Don't get me wrong, if you ask for someones advice they will share their thoughts and ideas, and offer allot of advice, as do most of the folks on this forum. It is usually just a matter of them helping you by sharing what works best for them. There is one good thing about the "elite" group, they usually have their nose so far up in the air that they don't even notice that you are ignoring them!   Happy Trails!

[McDowra]

Well said Rob, the only person that can make you feel inferior is you! 

[dreamweaver]

As I read your discussion- the mental image I received was of the stereotyped "cowboy"  arriving to vacation at a dude ranch- new boots, Fancy New Western shirt- shiny large belt buckle- looks the part- but has no clue which end of the horse is which.  Everyone loves to obtain new gear.  But experience usually has a quiet humility that is rarely flashy.  It is a badge that has been earned through mistakes, failures, and victories.  That is the mentor you should seek.

As a nurse I enjoy being around people, caring for people, talking with people. But being with people who are casual acquaintances with whom the conversation is very superficial drains me mentally and emotionally.  I need alone time or time with close friends with whom I share a close bond to recharge.  Does that make me anti-social? Not in the literal definition of a person with an anti-social personality disorder- but I must have time away from superficial interaction.  My daughter, who is a social butterfly, cannot understand my need to breathe anymore than I can understand her need to have people around her all the time.  She cannot stand to be alone.   I need to spend time with me.  Therefore I hike.

[Cuffs]

In the world of backpacking, the mantra is HYOH... Hike Your Own Hike.  This breaks down to hike where you want, how far you want, carrying whatever gear you want.  If it works for you, then great!  Get out and hike!

In my backpacking clinics, I have never stated specifically a brand and/or model of gear that every person should carry, and several here can attest to that.  I will tell everyone you need a pack, a bag, a shelter, water treatment...  What brand / model you carry is up to you after that.  What works for one, will not, and rarely, works for another.

I will try to guide folks towards gear that may make their trip more enjoyable, or away from gear that may actually be detrimental to their well-being.  (You really dont want to take a down bag hiking in the rainy Pacific NW...)

That being said... I have a self-admitted gear fetish and have become a label-whore.  Prior to my becoming a outdoor retail manager, I just got what I could, when I could afford it, name brand or not.  Only because of the OMG deals I have access to, I now wear and carry all the top-of-the-line stuff.  Again, this is only because of what I pay for the stuff.  What I used to pay for knock-off stuff is now what I pay for all the best brands.  I feel very fortunate that I have this stuff, but oddly, most (almost all) of it does not get me any further down the trail any faster than any of my other gear.  And frankly, Im so OCD about the care of my gear, most of that fancy name brand stuff stays home, I dont want to get it dirty!!    So the good ol stand bys go with me to the trail. 

There are several in the hiking community that are the antithesis of HYOY... that is HMH... Hike My Hike.  These folks will preach to you about all the wrong stuff (in their minds) you are carrying.  They make everyones trip miserable.  Sadly, they will always be out there and you just cant teach them to hush up...

[buck]

This thread reminds me of a hunting club I was in several years back.

For the most part, those of us who had been in the club the longest never once paid any attention to the brand clothing, gun, etc. We just hunted. A father and his two sons joined the club one year. He was a very successful business man. He pulled a very large camper to the club grounds, hooked up his satellite television, sewage, etc. The rest of us slept in what was more or less an old wood shed. He wore browning boots, outerwear, shot a 7mm top of the line rifle, a scope that could look to the outer limits of the universe, and smoked the finest cigars money could buy. Me, I carried a 30-30 rifle my dad purchased from Fred's as a Christmas gift when I was a teenager. My clothes, well they all came from Wal-Mart - even my boots and scope. The rich hunter set up a tripod stand in the woods and rode his new fourwheeler to the hunting spot. Me, I carried my treestand and a sack of clothes on my back for 30 minutes to the area I hunted.

Though we often had to sit and listen to him and his sons boast of their "things," I often listened to their boasting while I was cleaning and processing my deer. I had the cheapest gun and clothing, but I think I was accomplishing my objective for being there to start with. He, on the other hand, never seemed to find such enjoyment because his expensive "things" did not automatically result in meat on the table. If high dollar "stuff" was what it was all about, then this man would have been more than satisfied.

Please don't imply that I think high dollar items are wrong or those who have them are unable to satisfy themselves. I know this is not the case in every instance. My point is that equipment and technique mean very little when the one they belong to is enjoying themselves and accomplishing the objectives that bring them there to start with.

[dreamweaver]

   Another example of- it is not always what you own but what you know!!!

[Tim Rich]

Good thread.  This issue comes up periodically with AT hikers and a perceived pecking order of section hikers, weekenders, thruhikers and dayhikers.  As has been said, if someone is looking to define themselves in a manner to prove their worth or superiority, they will always be looking for "things" to fill that void.  How much/where you hike, your job, your car, etc. are merely things you do and/or have.  If you let yourself be defined by them, they own you.

On the gear front, I try to buy good gear and wear it out.  My thermarest is about 18 years old and is still going strong.  My 20 degree bag is over ten years old, and my larger pack is about eight or ten.  We've gone through two stoves in 20 years, same pot for 15.  My bivy shelter is over ten years old, too.  I have some hike-only clothing items that are over ten years old.

My only piece of new gear is a year old Katadyn water filter that replaced a ten plus year old MSR Waterworks (frame cracked), and I love it.

Take Care,

Tim