18 years ago

[jaybird]

http://www.sierraclub.org...lanet/199511/bankhead.asp

Came across this article while doing some other research.  I was thinking how much things have changed in those 18 years since the clearcut in Indian Tomb Hollow.  The Bankhead Monitor became Wild Alabama, then Wild South -- which eventually merged with the Southern Appalachian Biodiversity Project and moved it's HQ to Asheville, NC taking Lamar Marshall with it.  The Trading Post in Wren is no longer owned or operated by Marshall either, even though Wild Alabama still maintains a solid presence there.  I've been told that Lamar moved due to the fact that he'd had so many threats on his life over the years, and he just got tired of it. 

What are we doing to ensure that the things Lamar and the others gained are not being lost?  Not necessarily to people, mind you.  But, maybe to the pigs.  I see these wild pigs as one of the single biggest threats to the biodiversity of the forest -- and I see NOTHING being done about them.  Whole stands of unique plants are being rooted up, and then the entire hillside erodes into the creek.  The whole character of the Sipsey is changing.  Suggestions?  Thoughts?

[Nalgene Ninja]

The Nature Conservancy and NPS used a pro hunting company from Australia to clear out the pigs on the Channel Islands, probably would work here too.

Freaking things came through my  campsite both nights this week, scared the crap outta me.

[WolfVanZandt]

We don't have the original predators to keep them under control.

I saw a farming program not to long ago that had a spot of wild pigs. The narrator mentioned that, once you let them get established, you can't get rid of them.

That's not precisely true.

Reintroduce the original predators. But the farmers and hunters are too afraid that they'll have to share prey with wolves that they're not going to do that.

So give up. They're like fire ants. Run them out of the area and they'll go somewhere else for awhile and then they'll be back as soon as the smoke settles. And they breed like farm cats.....

[geohiker]

I'll check with Janice Barrett our out reach coordinator at Wild South about your question.  I agree with ya the pig population is getting outta hand.  I've told many hunters about areas I've noticed heavy boar rooting, problem is the pigs are getting "smarter" and moving into the protected areas of the Sypsey.   
I suggest contacting the ranger office at Double Springs.  The more complaints they receive the more likely they will respond to the problem.

geohiker

[Uncle Wayne]

http://www.alatrails.com/...dex.php/topic,1568.0.html

Here's the word from the Forest Service from a meeting I attended earlier this year.  Despite opinions to the contrary, they are doing what they can with limited resources.

[WolfVanZandt]

problem is the pigs are getting "smarter" and moving into the protected areas of the Sypsey.

That's pretty much what's happening with the deer population in the state.

This is, in essence, what I saw on the farming show I mentioned. Noticed it said that trapping and removal is the most effective procedure to address the problem but thte last couple of paragraphs indicate that it's not all that effective because hogs thst get through just continue to breed and hunters and farmers are on cross purposes about this.

http://southeastfarmpress.com/news/wild-hogs-0407/

[jaybird]

I suggest contacting the ranger office at Double Springs.  The more complaints they receive the more likely they will respond to the problem.

That sounds like an awesome idea!  Can someone round us up the current ranger's name and address?

I know of one population of Dutchman's Breeches (a pretty rare wildflower for the Sipsey) that is now gone due to the pigs.  And, it was the only population that I and others were aware of.  Last spring, a population of Yellow Lady Slippers looked as though someone had been digging around in them.  My first thought was wildflower poachers, but the more I looked and thought -- it was the blasted pigs.  I heard a report this spring that the slippers were still there, but for how long?

Is there a provision of the Sipsey Wilderness bill that allows (should it ever come to it) a waiver of the motorized vehicle access for FS vehicles to access the inner wilderness roads to place traps for pig removal and destruction?  I know they have a couple of scheduled hunts in the wilderness every year, but hunters have to carry out what they kill, and this dissuades most from participating.  I think we have to start asking these questions.

[Uncle Wayne]

That sounds like an awesome idea!  Can someone round us up the current ranger's name and address?

I know of one population of Dutchman's Breeches (a pretty rare wildflower for the Sipsey) that is now gone due to the pigs.  And, it was the only population that I and others were aware of.   

Is there a provision of the Sipsey Wilderness bill that allows (should it ever come to it) a waiver of the motorized vehicle access for FS vehicles to access the inner wilderness roads to place traps for pig removal and destruction?  I know they have a couple of scheduled hunts in the wilderness every year, but hunters have to carry out what they kill, and this dissuades most from participating.  I think we have to start asking these questions.

Jaybird,

Here's the last word I have from the forest service on the hog problem:   So far they have trapped over 150 hogs and hunters have turned in 95 killed during the two week season prior to Turkey Season.  They are building some portable traps that can be moved to locations of fresh activity, approximate cost $225 each.  They currently have 12 fixed traps located through out the forest. They guesstimate the hog population at 1700 + in the Bankhead. 

The hogs will be a problem the rest of our lives.  The turkey population, especially during the nesting season, was thought to be in danger.  However they have adapted to the hog problem very well in the Bankhead.  The FS told me that the first week of turkey season this year there were more "kills" turned in than the whole month long season  last year.  This past April turned out to be a record month for turkey hunters in Alabama.  And that just the ones that are turned in to the FS at the checking station. The biggest threat the hogs are to other wildlife in the forest is the competition they are to the food supply.  The hogs will eat any and everything.  Deer and turkey will not.

Of course wildflowers can't adapt to the rooting and devastation the hogs are causing.  The only permanent answer there is to eradicate the hogs or less desirable, fence in the areas of sensitive vegetation like they did in the Smoky mountains.

I don't believe the motorized ban in the wilderness will never be changed.  And another thing about hunting hogs.  You can leave them where you shoot them unless you want the meat. The FS only want a tail to prove a kill.  To tell you the truth, from what I know has been tried to eradicate the hogs, I'd be afraid to eat any of the meat because of the "unauthorized" poisoning attempts that are ongoing.  To each his own I guess.

The Dutchman breeches are still flourishing in the Bankhead, don't worry about them being extinct yet.  Yellow lady slippers are much less common however.  And of course are threatened by the hogs every day.

[Nalgene Ninja]

http://www.nps.gov/chis/p...-on-santa-cruz-island.htm

[Nalgene Ninja]

And of course some people are going to gripe.
http://www.dailynexus.com/article.php?a=9160

[jaybird]

Here's the info. I pulled up from the FS website.  I'm gonna compose a letter to him in the next day or so stating that I appreciate what is being done, and that I understand the funding issues at this point in our nation's economy.  However, I'd like to know what else can be done before more unique wildflower and water resources are permanently damaged.  I'll cite the Channel Islands and Santa Cruz Island examples (thanks NN for those!) as possible paths to model.

Bankhead National Forest
Glen Gaines, Ranger
1070 Hwy 33 North
Double Springs, AL  35553
205-489-5111

[Uncle Wayne]

Here's the info. I pulled up from the FS website.  I'm gonna compose a letter to him in the next day or so stating that I appreciate what is being done, and that I understand the funding issues at this point in our nation's economy.  However, I'd like to know what else can be done before more unique wildflower and water resources are permanently damaged.  I'll cite the Channel Islands and Santa Cruz Island examples (thanks NN for those!) as possible paths to model.

Bankhead National Forest
Glen Gaines, Ranger
1070 Hwy 33 North
Double Springs, AL  35553
205-489-5111

The address is correct but Glen Gaines is "on loan" to another district through July I believe.  There's another guy acting in his place now but I don't remember his name. I'd address it to simply Forest Ranger, Bankhead Forest" and whoever is in charge will get the letter.  If you address it to Gaines, it may lay around until he gets back.  JMHO.

Letter writing can't hurt.  One thing I complained about when i contacted them was the destruction of the old primitive cemeteries in the forest.  Several of my and my wife's ancestors are buried in those cemeteries, located in different areas of the forest.  The hogs are destroying them also.

[Old Hickory]

I worked for several years as a hunting guide and manager of a game plantation in the low country of South Carolina. I've killed over a hundred wild hogs personally, and trapped many more. I've hunted them with rifles, handguns, bows, dogs and knives.

Getting rid of the hogs would be fairly simple.

• Place a $50 per tail bounty on them
• Change the regs to allow baiting

Problem solved.

[Uncle Wayne]

Getting rid of the hogs would be fairly simple.

• Place a $50 per tail bounty on them
• Change the regs to allow baiting

Problem solved.

That was kinda suggested in the meeting I attended.  Someone asked why they didn't allow hunters to hunt them year round.  They didn't just say it but it was clear they can't / don't trust the average hunter to only hunt hogs.

A friend and I were talking about it after the meeting and he suggested they ought to hire "bounty hunters" similar to what they did with they cleaned the tree falls out of the trails a few years ago.  The FS brought in professional trail maintenace personell from Colorado and they did a really good job of clearing the main trails through the wilderness.  I met several of them and they really knew what they were doing. 

Someone of your background, Old hickory, would know what to do or who to hire.  It'd take someone who knew hogs and how to hunt them.  As much time as I spend in the forest, I have never seen a hog close enough to kill it. 

I plan on suggesting hiring bounty hunters at our next meeting in July. I'll try to post the date of the meeting in time  that some of you can make plans to attend.

[montysano]

Freaking things came through my  campsite both nights this week, scared the crap outta me.

Has this problem gotten noticeably worse the last year or so?  Personally, I've had no hog encounters, but then I didn't get out at all this last winter.

[Pully]

I would say it has become noticeably worse. Several years ago, I rarely saw a hog in Bankhead, maybe heard 1 or 2 the whole year and would see 3 over a 4 year span. Now, this past winter/spring, On 3 different occasions I've come across a group of 15+ on Bunyan Hill road (224), group of 15+ near trail 201, and on Quillan came within 25 feet of a large hog and saw 3 babies and a sow.

[jaybird]

I'll try to post the date of the meeting in time that some of you can make plans to attend.

Please do!  I'll try my best to make it.

[Old Hickory]

Hogs are migratory in nature - they travel in packs and they come and they go. Basically they move into an area, overgraze it to the extreme and then move on. Think of a roving pack. What is a good hunting spot this week may go totally cold by next week. That's why trapping and hunting them is so hit or miss. They are very hot natured and won't be caught far from water in the summer. Without water in hot weather, they'll die in a day or so. They are blind as a bat, but have extremely good sense of smell. If the wind is in your favor, you can get very close to them. If the wind is in their favor - you'll never see them.

I'll go ahead and post this information and folks can use it as they see fit. Baiting is illegal in Alabama. Remember that.

The absolute best bait is soured corn. Take a barrel and fill it with 50 lbs of dry whole corn. Fill it with water and let it sit in the hot sun for a few days. The corn will absorb the water, so make sure you use enough water to keep the corn submerged. Let it ferment - like you are making mash for whiskey. After a week or so in the sun, the mash will begin to stink. When it stinks to high heaven, it's ready.

Get an Alabama PhD (post hole digger) and find a good hunting spot - near water and near recent hog sign. Look for rooting in the ground, mud hole 'wallows' and especially look for trees that have mud smeared on the trunk about knee height. Hogs roll in the mud then scratch against the trees leaving mud on the trunk. I've seen trees that have had the bark rubbed off completely.

Sink a hole with a post hole digger about 2-3 feet deep. Fill with the sour mash corn. Splash corn water around it.

The hogs will smell the corn from a mile away. Having it sunk into a deep narrow hole makes them spend time digging it out - they can't just eat corn off the ground and scram. The more time they spend digging it out, the more likely you are to get a shot at them. Pouring corn water into the dirt will keep them coming back long after the corn has been dug out and eaten. The deep hole also makes the corn extremely difficult for the game warden to see. You have to be right on top of it to see it. Forget about spotting it from an airplane.

I could post a lot more if people are interested.

[Uncle Wayne]

I could post a lot more if people are interested.

I'm very interested. Please do and thanks for sharing your expertise. 

[Old Hickory]

OK. Here's what we used to call the "dinner bell".

Let's say you have vehicular access to a place and want to hunt hogs. You put out treestands just like you would for deer hunting. Maybe you have four or five spots you can hunt, and perhaps you have put out some bait, but aren't sure which treestand would be the best to hunt.

Take a 55 gallon drum or similar container and put some of the sour corn in it. Cap the lid on the drum tightly. Cut a 4"x4" hole in the middle of the drum, maybe one on each side. Lay the drum on it's side. The hogs will smell the sour corn and will go nuts trying to get it out of the drum. Once they roll the drum a little, the corn will dispense out of the 4x4 hole. Kind of like those dog toys that you push a dog bone into and the dog has to get the treat out of the toy. Same principle. This will make them work for the bait and spend a lot of time at the bait station rolling the drum around. If you attach a cowbell to the drum, the bell will make noise as they roll the drum. The hogs will pay more attention to their stomach than to the bell clanking.

If you have a bait barrel at each of your hunting spots, all you have to do is drive down the dirt roads at night in your area and park and listen. If you hear the cowbell clanging - you know the hogs are working that barrel. That's where I'd hunt the next morning.